Roststempeln (Oprørsstempler) on DK skilling issues

  • Hi all


    I recently got the attached on auction. Its a 4 skilling 1858-issue, with Roststempel 40. The Bruun-Rasmussen auctioneers believe it to be genuine and I tend to agree with them. However, there is no expert certificate with the stamp.


    In this connection I have two questions, which I would like your opinion on:
    Given it is genuine, I do not recall I have seen such a late usage of Roststempeln on Danish skilling stamps - they normally appear on 4 RBS and 4 skilling 1854. Neither ARGE, AFA Special or DAKA lists Roststempeln on the 1858-issues, so I am wondering if any of you would have knowledge of such ?


    The Roststempeln were allowed to be used on DK stamps from July 1st 1853, but I have never seen an end/decommission date. Given the seemingly "unstructured management history" of the Roststempeln, I would not be surprised if there were no clear rules about the end date of usage - but have any of you seen an end date or the latest known usage ?


    Cheers
    Ole

  • Hi Ole,


    Welcome.


    I think as well that this Roststempel is genuine.


    There are other examples on the DK 1858-issue. I have never seen an end date but the latest usage is at least 1862.
    In any case your stamp is very rare.


    Kind regards,
    nordlicht

  • Hi Nordlicht


    While I was looking into the matter, I read some sources that indicated that Roststempeln must exist on the 1858-issue, but I'm glad you can confirm this. I was not aware they were known used as late as 1862. Very interesting.


    Though not a Danish stamp, I notice that ARGE lists SH#7 from 1864 to exist with Roststempel 33 (Hohenwestede / Remmels). That is, however, most likely an exceedingly rare case.


    Thanks a lot for the info and swift answer!


    Cheers
    Ole

  • Hi Ole,


    thank you for introducing me to the term "oprørsstempler". I can honestly say that I had never heard of it before. But then, history always has two sides. While the big countries like England or France get their fair share of recognition in that respect (and have the power to make themselves heard), our smaller neighbouring countries usually do not get the same attention. For us Germans, the S-H story is a comparatively small hurdle on the path of Germany becoming a nation. For Denmark, it must have felt like an amputation that left a deep scar.


    Welcome to the forum, btw.


    Best regards,
    Dietmar

    Viele Grüße aus Erding!


    Achter Kontich wonen er ook mensen!

  • Hi Dietmar


    Thanks for your welcome greeting and post.


    You are absolutely right about the scars, which are a large part of Danish history. Especially the loss of basically everything between Hamburg and Kolding in 1864 was devastating to Denmark.
    After the referendum and following Unification with Sønderjylland in 1920 ("Genforeningen" - 100 year anniversary next year!) - and particularly immediately after World War 2 - there was some bitterness among the supporters of the danish minority on the German side of the border: They had hoped the negotiations of the border line could be re-opened. I think though, that this bitterness have largely died along with my grandparent's generation.



    About the Roststempeln, I can add that the Danish term for this cancellation type, "Oprør", (=rebellion, insurgency) refers to the Holsteiners revolting against the Danes in 1848-50. The rebellions issued their own stamps (Postschillinge) and manufactured these brass Roststempeln to cancel them. After the revolt ended, I guess the cancellors were put in the drawers, until the Danish post administration decided they could be used in emergency situations, from 1853 - for instance when the normal cancellor was missing or malfunctioning at the post office.


    Cheers
    Ole

  • Hallo zusammen,


    Ich finde eure Beiträge nicht nur sehr interessant, sondern auch sehr lehrreich.
    Leider kann ich nichts Erhellendes hierzu beitragen, aber ich lese sehr gerne mit.


    Liebe Grüße derzeit immer noch auf Sylt, direkt an der dänischen Grenze
    Heribert

    Einmal editiert, zuletzt von hasselbert ()

  • Hallo Heribert - Viele Grüße nach wunderschöne Sylt!



    To my knowledge the history of the Roststempeln can be summarized like this:


    1st Period: Intended to cancel Postschillinge (15.11.1850 - 31.8.1851)
    - There were originally created 42 different numeral cancellors. Given the general rarity of genuinely cancelled Postschillinge, I am not certain whether there still exist examples of all 42 numerals.
    - After the end date, all 42 cancellors were supposed to be returned to the postal administration, but its is said, that only four were returned.


    2nd Period: Emergency cancellations on Danish stamps (1.8.1853 - 1862 or later)
    - The numerals 3, 12, 18, 19, 34, 39 and 40 are known to exist on Danish stamps. Most commonly on "Fire RBS" and 4 skilling 1854. But as this thread demonstrates, also on the 1858-issue.
    - To my knowledge are 19 and 39 rare, while the rest are very rare.


    3rd Period: Usage in S-H
    - According to ARGE is numeral 33 known to exist on SH#7 (1,25 Schilling 1864)


    Cheers
    Ole

  • Moin,


    1st Period: Intended to cancel Postschillinge (15.11.1850 - 31.8.1851)


    The end date is known from some literature but it is not correct. The danish authorities stopped selling the Postschillinge but tolerated using them. So Postschillinge were used and cancelled with Roststempel until the beginning of 1852 when Denmark took over the postal administration in Holstein.


    I am not certain whether there still exist examples of all 42 numerals

    There is no evidence of all 42 Roststempel, e.g. No. 8 (Krempe) is not known and No. 42 (Schwartau) may be never exist.
    Two million Postsschillinge were produced but only about 12000 were used. Some smaller cities did not sell any Postschilling (e.g. Krempe) so it is not surprising that some Roststempel have not been seen yet.


    Roststempel is a quite interesting research topic but unfortunately not that cheap ...


    Mange hilsener
    nordlicht

  • Hi Nordlicht,


    Thanks for the updates and precisions. The literature I have available in this field is sparse and somewhat inaccurate, so I appreciate your insights!


    I am still searching for a flawless affordable used copy of each of the Postschillinge (I may need to skip the "affordable"-criteria:-). It will, however, require a miracle in my household economy, before I start a collection of numerals on Postschillinge..


    Cheers
    Ole

    Einmal editiert, zuletzt von Aabenraaer ()

  • Here's a Fire RBS Thiele I with a weak impression of Roststempel 39 (Holstein Eisenbahn) - which is probably why it's also cancelled with an ink-cross.

    According to cert. Vagn Jensen it's plate I, position 1 (so-called "hakmærke") - I think this is not too obvious due to the ink from the postmark, but then again, I am far from being an expert in the plating of Fire RBS.


    The brass Roststempeln were generally thought of being of poor quality, which this cancellation certainly indicates :)


    Cheers Ole

  • Hello Ole,


    Thank you for showing this very interesting item. The addition ink cancellation makes it even more impressive. Nevertheless I have to admit that I would not have been able to identify the number of the Roststempel. ;)

    It is still a mystery why these Roststempel were re-used at all since the Danish number cancellation was already in place at that time (for the railyways too).


    Kind regards,
    nordlicht

  • Hi Nordlicht


    I agree - I would have expected an ink cancellation when normal equipment was unavailable. The stamp also demonstrates, that ink cancelling was indeed known/used - but apparently not always first choice..


    Half of the known Roststempeln on dk skilling sounds "Railway-ish" and the other half are from larger cities with railway stations. Possibly some kind of exceptional designated use for Holstein Eisenbahn mail, rather than emergency usage? If that's the case, maybe there could exist blue 2sk with Roststempel😊


    When you have the stamp at hand, under a magnifying glass, it's actually not too difficult to identify the postmark. Still, the almost greyish ink is so vague on the brown background, that I can't get my scanner to catch much more than the stripes in the margen...



    Cheers
    Ole