Frankreich - Taxis über die Pfalz

bayern klassisch

Liebe Freunde,

in der Vormarkenzeit gibt es einige wenige Briefe, die von Hessen (TT) über die Pfalz (Worms - Oggersheim - Neustadt - Landau - Bergzabern - Wissembourg) in den Bezirk liefen, der eng um das elsässische Weißenburg gezogen war. Man kann sie nur an dem Grenzübergangsstempel erkennen. Einen aus Mainz habe ich begefügt.

Nun ist es mir gelungen, das Pendant zu schnappen, nämlich einen aus Soultz-sous-Forets, ganz nahe bei Wissembourg gelegen, nach Frankfurt vom 9.12.1846. Weil er aus dem Nahbereich stammte (Taxisbriefe stammten NIE aus dem Nahbereich nach Frankreich) erhielt er zutreffend den Stempel "Dep.(artement) Limit(rophe)", also Nachbar - Departement und war somit gebührenermässigt.

Bei den Gebühren könnte man mir etwas helfen - 6x dürfte Frankreich bekommen haben und 18x sollte das Endporto in Frankfurt am Main gewesen sein. Die Rechnung oben 2 = 7 könnte lauten: 2 Decimes = 7 Kreuzer, aber da bin ich mir nicht sicher, weil es auch der 1. Brief dieser Art ist, den ich zu sehen bekomme.

Siegelseitig haben wir den Transitstempel von Wissembourg, der belegt, dass er nicht über Forbach oder Strasbourg, was prinzipiell Alternativen gewesen wäre, lief.

Liebe Grüsse von bayern klassisch

robfaux

Hello everyone!

Here is an item that I could use a little help with.

Posted on November 12, 1867 at La Ferte sous Jouarre and placed on the train from Paris to Reims. Sadly, the markings are very weak, so I can't be sure from there, but it looks like it may have gone via Forbach.

There is a Grossallmerode marking for November 14 and Trubenhausen looks like a nice little settlement to the east. Small enough and with enough farming to perhaps be a place I would like.

I believe Witzenhausen, Grossallmerode and Trubenhausen were part of Hesse-Cassel - so that should mean this item should have been rated for the first rayon of Prussia - so that would be 40 centimes per 10 grams. It appears to have gone via Thurn & Taxis mail - given the blue 1/2 marking. But, I also think that rate was 40 centimes per 10 grams as of April 1862?

Two questions:

Is this just an overpayment of the 40 centime rate?

What is the 1/2 marking indicating? 1/2 silbergroschen for delivery?

thank you for any comments or help.

Rob

bayern klassisch

Hello Rob

Nice one. I can´t read the handstamps of the backside, but Paris - Forbach - Saarbrücken (Prussia) - Mainz - Frankfurt - Großalmerode (all Thurn und Taxis) should be the right route.

As it passed Prussia in a closed postbag, Prussia got nothing from the 50 Centimes. It should be 30 C. for France and 20 C. credit to Taxis. 1/2 Silbergroschen had to be paid by the addressee from the last postoffice to his home. Single letters were 10g and it did not make any difference, wheather they were routed via Belgium oder Saarbrücken.

Hope that helped a little bit.

robfaux

Ralph,

Interesting. Was this rate still effective in 1867? I must admit that the Thurn and Taxis mails are difficult for me to understand once the Prussian-Austrian ware in 1866 was completed. The simplified explanations I have read just seem to say everything goes to Prussian postal control, but I know there had to be a transition period.

I use Bourgouin's site to check on rate periods from France (what a wonderful bit of work that site is!). It feels like there may be an error on this page as the top comment is that the rate is the same for unpaid letters coming to France as paid mail to Thurn & Taxis. But, the numbers differ between the two.

Thank you for the help. I will think on this more before I write this one up.

Best,

Rob

bayern klassisch

Hello Rob

Thurn und Taxis was the most difficult from foreign countries to tax or to frank, as they had different currencies there, they got letters from and to in open transit, or in closed bags - not easy to understand for everyone.

This website looks good - if he is right, the letter should have been overpaid by 10 Centimes - may be we need our French experts here, as they will know this for sure.